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Mystica

Masema - what's up with this?

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I've started a re-read from book 9 (Winter's Heart) onward and once again I find myself wondering the same question I had the previous time that I read this book.

 

Why is Masema allowed to run loose and do what he does for so long? I mean, if Rand took 5 minutes to travel to his sorry ass and set him straight, or even 'took care of him' that would solve this ever growing 'army' of rifraf. Instead he is left alone, treated with every care, even by those that 'do' have Rand's support, and in doing so he is given an authority Rand himself never gave him. On top of that, Masema is endangering Rand's efforts of uniting the nations and instead creates more and more anger and hate towards the 'Dragonsworn'. Not to mention the thousands of innocents that are killed, tortured and worse by this self proclaimed lunatic.

 

This has always been one part of the story that never made any sense to me whatsoever. Like right now in my re-read, Perrin has to bring him to Rand and yet he let's Masema (once again) set down the rules and do whatever he wants. I don't get it... I honestly don't. Why not wrap his ass up in the One Power, create a Gateway and toss him bodily through it at Rand's feet?

 

And if that doesn't work, then Rand himself should have put a stop to him LONG ago already, when the first words of Masema's doings reached him. This wouldn't have taken too much time for the Sacred Dragon Reborn, so it wouldn't have endangered any of his other plans. But because he doesn't want to deal with it, this idiot has been allowed to run amock in the vilest way short of being a Darkfriend himself.

 

 

This is definately one storyline I could do without. To me doesn't make sense at all.

 

Am I missing something important about this? Would there be a reason (other than having no time) for allowing this character to run loose for so long and causing so much trouble? I just don't see it.

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My thoughts on Masema's success are that someone nearby was manipulating events to ensure it. Rand did not get involved because he was busy, and arrogantly dismissive (its sort of the same as he is with Taim, if it ain't dealing with major things he ignores it--to him Masema was small fish).

 

But, my theory about Masema begins with Masuir and Annoura, and their random meeting with Masema.

 

Are They Actually Meeting Masema?

 

Well Masuri and Annoura both snuck into Masema's camp several times right up through to the end of KoD. Now Perrin believes they went to meet Masema himself, which stands to reason given that he is the only figure in that camp worth an Aes Sedai's attention, the rest all being rag tag zealots. Yet this seems strange--Masema hates Aes Sedai, and they don't seem too fond of him either. Perrin even notices that they seem to be growing to hate each other even more in spite of the ongoing meetings.

 

"...a pity you will not let the Seanchan leash all of them." [Masema's] sidelong glance at Annoura and Masuri said he included them, despite the fact that both had visited him in secret more than once. They regarded him with Aes Sedai calm, though Masuri's slim hands moved as if to smooth her brown skirts. She said she had changed her mind and now believed the man must be killed, so why was she meeting him? Why was Annoura? Why did Masema allow them? He more than hated Aes Sedai.

 

[KoD--The Last Knot--629]

 

So, several curiosities here. Let me state them...

 

1. Both Masuri and Annoura claim Masema must be killed--Masuri having originally believed she could use him has changed her mind--yet even after changing it, both she and Annoura continue to sneak into his camp.

 

2. Masema allows it, despite his hatred of Aes Sedai.

 

Or rather, these are the problems Perrin sees based on the idea of Masuri and Annoura meeting with Masema. Yet in truth neither Aes Sedai was seen with Masema. Selende says 'they have been meeting with Masema' but all that happened was that one of her people saw Masuri and her warder, and occasionally Annoura with them, sneaking into and out of the camp. He comments are clear on this--they were seen only in transit.

 

“Masuri Sedai has visited Masema… the Prophet. It is true my Lord; believe me! Havier has seen her more than once. She slips into their camp hooded and leaves the same way, but he has had a good look at her face twice.

 

They are never actually seen with Masema, and whilst he does some to be the only figure of note, given the above hatred that seems very hard to swallow. Of course they could be dissembling, all of them—yet Masuri clenching of her hands, her vocally changed opinion, these things seem more designed to draw attention to her re:Masema, which makes it unlikely all over again.

 

Well, if not Masema, then who?

 

So, if we remove Selende's assumption, and then take the above two points into account, then it seems very unlikely that they are meeting Masema--which raises the question of who are they meeting? Who else would be worthy of their attention? Who else would be a figure influencing events in Masema's horde? Well, the first step in answer that is to ask...

 

Is Someone Influencing Masema

 

The only evidence that might suggest that there is is in the fact of his success. Masema is insane--we know that for a fact from Perrin's nose. He is genuinely, deeply insane. Now, they say God protects the insane, but even so things have fallen neatly for him. No really genuine, organised opposition has formed against him--almost as if someone is subtly playing politics with the purpose of protecting Masema. But still, that's guesswork. The question is, if there is someone influencing things, why would they do so?

 

The only real answer is that it is to spread chaos--i.e. that this person is a darkfriend. I'll touch on this again in a bit.

 

The second step to answering this is in asking--why Masuri and Annoura? Or, put another way...

 

Why not Seonid?

 

Concider; we have a Green, a Brown and a Grey. The Green and the Brown are both rebels, whilst the Grey is unaffiliated. The Green and Brown are both oathsworn to the Dragon, whilst the Grey serves Berelain. The Green and the Brown are both apprentices to the Wise Ones, the Grey is 'technically' her own woman. Moreover the Grey and the Brown both support killing Masema, whilst initially the Green did not.

 

So why are the Brown and the Grey colluding, yet not including the Green? Havier has observed Masuri and Annoura entering the camp quite a few times, but Seonid is never present. There is no political or personal reasons for this strange grouping.

 

Well, no, thats not right. There is a theoretical reason for such a collusion--Annoura and Masuri are Black Ajah, Seonid is not. It's a guess, true, but it's the only thing that allows for those two to be acting together, yet exclude the other. On every other thing that might bring Aes Sedai together, yet exclude a third, they differ--Ajah, allegiances, history, temperament. If this is true it provides a stepping stone--Who would Masuri and Annoura interested in? becomes...

 

Who would the Black Ajah be interested in?

 

As I see it there are three options here.

 

1. A random darkfriend.

2. One of the Forsaken.

3. Another Black sister.

 

1. A Random Darkfriend.

 

This is the least likely to my mind. Why would two Aes Sedai need to meet so many times with some random darkfriend? There's nothing against it, but nothing for it either.

 

2. One of the Forsaken.

 

People have been suggesting this one for years. One of the Forsaken (usually Demandred, the go-to guy for unexplained plots) is manipulating Masema's rabid followers in order to spread chaos. At first glance it seems reasonable--they have been instructed to let the Lord of Chaos rule after all. The problem with this suggestion is that manipulating a mad man and his zealous mob would take way too much constant attention and subtle manipulation. It would be a full time job even for one of the Forsaken, and for its effects its just not worth their effort--oh, it creates chaos, but not on a grand enough scale to keep one of the big boys occupied full time.

 

Masema is just not a big enough fish. Now thats not to say that one of the Forsaken is not involved, just that they won't be doing it directly themselves. But I don't think it's Demandred. He is a general, direct action is his game--manipulating the fear and hatred of a pseudo-religious following, that’s much subtler--say something a spider would dream up.... which brings us to...

 

3. Another Black Sister. Or two.

 

Specifically, Berylla Neron and Rianna Andomeran.

 

In tFoH Moghedian assumes control of Liandrin's crew and gives them seperate jobs. For the most part we know what those jobs were; Ispan and Falion were sent to Ebou Dar. Eldrith, Asne, Chesmal, Marillin and Temaille accompanied her north, and later continued north to Caemlyn. This leave Rianna, Berylla and Jeaine. I exclude Jeaine because of her reaction to her instructions compared to the other two.

 

From where she stood, Liandrin could see their faces even if their mouths moved soundlessly for her. Plainly each woman was receiving orders the others knew nothing of. The faces told little, though. Rianna merely listened, a touch of relief in her eyes, bowed her head in assent and went. Marillin looked surprised, and then eager, but she had been a Brown, and Browns could be enthusiastic over anything that allowed them a chance to unearth some moldy bit of lost knowledge. Jeaine Caide donned a slow mask of horror, shaking her head at first and trying to cover herself and that disgustingly sheer gown, but Moghedien's face hardened, and Jeaine nodded hurriedly and fled, if not as eagerly as Marillin, just as quickly. Berylla Naron, lean almost to scrawniness and as fine a manipulator and plotter as there was, and Falion Bhoda, long-faced and cold despite her obvious fear, showed as little expression as Rianna had. Ispan Shefar, like Liandrin from Tarabon, though dark-haired, actually kissed Moghedien's hem before she rose.

 

[tFoH--18--A Hound of Darkness]

 

Berylla and Rianna both react calmly--indeed Berylla is compared to Rianna in her calmness, whilst Jeaine is horrified at her instructions. So it's just Berylla and Rianna that I suggest. But...

 

What makes this more likely than any other job Moghedian might have assigned?

 

1. Timing. Masema was just coming into his own as a frothing at the mouth religious leader at that time. Events in Ghealdin were becoming truly unstuck and the chaos was slipping south. Other nations were taking note. Effectibely Masema was entering the big boy game, and that was bound to attract notice.

 

2. Location. Moghedian was in a perfect position to be aware of Masema at this point. She was in Amadicia and planning to go north--straight towards him. She'd laid plans about going north also. In doing so she'd have to have encountered talk of Masema.

 

3. Temprement. Berylla is cited by Liandrin as being a deft manipulator and plotter. Rianna, a White, was described as cold with an eye that saw deep into you. Those two would be perfect for this, and Moghedian would be exactly the sort of person who would see it. A deft manipulator and a person who could perceive a persons flaws could tweak a growing mob in exactly the right ways to ensure it grows--they also explain Masema's ongoing survival--a mob should not have held up so well, but with two Aes Sedai, deft at politics, hamstringing the opposition....

 

Conclusions

 

So my theory is thus. Moghedian sent Berylla and Rianna to Masema in order that they ensure he continues in causing his chaos. Masuri and Annoura are black and have been meeting up with Berylla and Rianna to plot.

 

One Final Question

 

How was Masuri able to attend so many meetings without the Wise Ones knowing it? Answer... she almost probably couldn't.  ;D

 

 

 

 

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Wow Luckers, you should post that theory in the FAQ. I always just assumed that they were indeed visiting Masema. One thing we gotta remember is that while RJ was a fan of many little plotlines and secrets, we shouldn't be looking into things TOO deeply. Or else we get confused and read too much into the text.

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Not sure about Masema himself but in CoS Jaichim Carridins PoV revealed he was responsible for "the Dragonsworn" (inverted commas were in his PoV, possible hint that they were Darkfriends). As far as we know Carridin served Sammael, and although he encountered Shaidar 0.5 I cant recall any other hints at him working with any other Forsaken.

 

Also, there was a mysterious figure on horseback in one of the late books that hawkeyed Masema and Perrin when they met at one point. Not sure what was going on there but I definitely agree someone is manipulating Masema somehow.

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Not sure about Masema himself but in CoS Jaichim Carridins PoV revealed he was responsible for "the Dragonsworn" (inverted commas were in his PoV, possible hint that they were Darkfriends). As far as we know Carridin served Sammael, and although he encountered Shaidar 0.5 I cant recall any other hints at him working with any other Forsaken.

 

Also, there was a mysterious figure on horseback in one of the late books that hawkeyed Masema and Perrin when they met at one point. Not sure what was going on there but I definitely agree someone is manipulating Masema somehow.

 

Well before Pedron Niall died he came up with a plan to use the Children to go incognito as "Dragonsworn" in Altara, Murandy, and Illian, in order to force them together with him against the Dragon. Niall gave this task to Carridin, who organized it, so it is most likely those "dragonsworn" that Carridin is talking about

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wow Luckers! that's one hell of a reply LOL. thanks!

 

Yeah, I considered Rand not taking much notice of Masema till it was too late (to stop the murderous actions in the Dragon's name). I hadn't considered Masema being manipulated though, that's definately a possibility.

 

Given his state of insanity, I wonder if Rand 'will' be able to handle him at this point. What with all his 'channeling is for the Dragon Reborn only' crap. I wonder what Cadsuane is going to make of this piece of vermin. Or the Wise Ones with Rand. Or the Ashaman. Taim will undoubtedly try to get his hands on a few of those dragonsworn, but what will Logain make of it?

 

I dunno, seems to me that there's quite a bit of room for storywise hickups here. No one dares to stand against him at this point. No army, no Aes Sedai, no nothing. And then Rand is going to point and thousands of raping/looting/murdering criminals are just going to go head down where he points? That just doesn't make any sense. Not even for a lunatic like Masema. He's bound to claim that Rand has been turned at some point and that it's his 'solemn duty' to save his soul by killing his body, or some other religious nonsense like that.

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Fortunatly, Masema does not have thousands of raping/looting/murdering criminals for Rand to have to deal with anymore. After Malden, he is down to a few hundred. And after the Aram-debacle, there is no way Perrin will stick to the original plan of bringing Masema & His Crazy Bunch to Rand.

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Although Masema is now near a 100,000 demoralised ex-slaves. Such people provide the perfect recruitment pool for religious fanatics.

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im still at the 'go out and rescue faile' part, so yeah my views are a bit limited for the moment on all the later stuff. I will catch up though! I will get you Maj. I will!

 

*need to read faster* there's so much I've forgotten about the later books. *Sigh*

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Rand really needs to wake up to the realities of Travelling. Go to the Black Tower and kick Taim all about the place in the morning, hell go to the White for lunch and set things straight, whack Masema and be back in Tear in time for tea. He could even have dinner in Tear then head over to Ebou Dar to have a chit chat with Tuon over another dinner, Ebou Dar's gotta be at least one time zones back from Tear.

 

Any character who can Travel could do that, and given that ATM that's almost everyone (all the rebels, all the reds, all the blacks probably, all the asha'man, all the Wise Ones, all the Windfinders, all the forsaken) and yet almost no one appears to be doing anything of the sort. Really guys, come on, you can instantly be anywhere in the world and you're still following your wife around on a horse for three books? Sitting on your ass outside a fortress/city? Moping around outside Tear? JOINING THE CIRCUS?! In one busy day any of the key players could set helf the world straight.

 

Rand back a good few books : hi guys I'm the Dragon Reborn, nice to see you, sorry I took so long to get to you but y'know how it is, galvanizing the world to fight the Dark One isn't an easy job. Just dropping by to let ya'll know how much I respect what you're doing here, holding the Boarderlands, keep your armies here and keep up the good work.

Boarderlands : Sounds like a plan.

 

~~~~

 

Egwene : Hi Rand, remember how we're childhood friends, we're not going to spend this entire meeting one-upping eachother and demanding respect and generally trying to out-arrogant one another like a pair of childish morons, if that's ok?

Rand : Yea, that might be productive.

Egwene : Yeah so, I got this whole white tower situation, let's y'know work together and see if we can get everything together or else we're going to get rolled in TG. Hows about we travel into the tower, and express our displeasure to Elaida.

Rand : Sure, but can we make it quick? Your best friend the Queen of Andor, the walking plot device who dresses like a boy, that snarky Aiel chick and I have finally found a hole in our joint schedules for a four-way, just as was predicted in a recent Dragonmount poll.

 

etc.

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Although Masema is now near a 100,000 demoralised ex-slaves. Such people provide the perfect recruitment pool for religious fanatics.

 

There is that. On the other hand, we got to see that Faile is ready to take some responsibility for these people. And if we tie this in with the upcoming nation building it seems likely Perrin and Faile will be involved with, these 100000 would be a perfect start to populate the relatively empty area between Saldea and the southern parts. That is my guess about what will happen to at least the bulk of them.

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Indeed. Plus, to be perfectly honest, I think Masema will die in the crossfire between Perrin and Masuri and Annoura.

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Your very good luckers  very good. i can see it  happening as you wrote it. i suspect  anyone in the books as  being black ajah etc that we dont have a pov from  and who is to say that some of those wise ones arent darkfriends as well. I  hope galad kills  masema would be a way to get him  intertwined with perrins arc and meeting berelain.

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ROFL Tyrell! brilliant!

 

I think Elayne will have a thing or two to say about the Two Towers becoming a seperate nation again, since it technically belongs to Andor.

 

Maj, isn't Saldea somewhere really up North in Randland (not good at the geography thing)? How would those 100k people found a new nation in places that already belong to other nations? how are they 'empty'? sorry if that's a dumb question, but I was always under the impression that all land (maybe excepting the location of the rebel Tower) was claimed by one nation or another.

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how are they 'empty'? sorry if that's a dumb question, but I was always under the impression that all land (maybe excepting the location of the rebel Tower) was claimed by one nation or another.

 

claimed is not to say populated

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true, but any population that settles in on a claimed plot of land would automatically fall under that land's ruler's um rule, no? I doubt any King or Queen is going to just hand over parts of their Kingdom to Miss 'I wanna be in the history books' Faile and her drooling husband.

 

(sorry, I really don't like Perrin anymore since he's hooked up with that kid. Used to be my favorite, so it's kinda' touchy for me lol)

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ROFL Tyrell! brilliant!

 

I think Elayne will have a thing or two to say about the Two Towers becoming a seperate nation again, since it technically belongs to Andor.

 

Maj, isn't Saldea somewhere really up North in Randland (not good at the geography thing)? How would those 100k people found a new nation in places that already belong to other nations? how are they 'empty'? sorry if that's a dumb question, but I was always under the impression that all land (maybe excepting the location of the rebel Tower) was claimed by one nation or another.

 

Far from all land is claimed anymore. Look at the map. Baerlon is the northernmost city in Andor, and nporth of Baerlon there is not much land before you hit Andors northernmost border. Now, look at the southermost point of Saldea. The distance between the two is greater than the distance between Cairhien and Tar Valon. There is an unclaimed landmass south/southeast of Saldea that is about three times as large as Andor.

 

IIRC correctly, Verin speaks of this in TGH, how the worlds population is declining, and as a result the nations borders are retreating.

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wow you memorized all those details? *blinks*

 

you're such a Brown :P

 

*goes to check on the maps*

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well there is a whole strip of land literally w/ no country or ruler south of the borderlands and a large chunk directly south of Saldea and Kandor , the Black Hills and west of it,  no country controls any of it but many villages dot it, if u remember in tGH Ingtar explains it when they set off after Fain and the horn and dagger

 

now this empty land is just north of Baerlon and TR quite a lovely land for 100k freed people to live feeling safe and secure because Lord Perrin and Lady Faile will protect them

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IIRC correctly, Verin speaks of this in TGH, how the worlds population is declining, and as a result the nations borders are retreating.

 

It was actually Ingtar--he also cites this as his reason for joining the Shadow.

 

But yes, the Caralain Grass between Andor and Saldaea is neither claimed by any nation, nor populated at all. The idea of the 100,000 settling there never occured to me but its brilliant.

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IIRC correctly, Verin speaks of this in TGH, how the worlds population is declining, and as a result the nations borders are retreating.

 

It was actually Ingtar--he also cites this as his reason for joining the Shadow.

 

But yes, the Caralain Grass between Andor and Saldaea is neither claimed by any nation, nor populated at all. The idea of the 100,000 settling there never occured to me but its brilliant.

 

Right, Ingtar. Verin just seemed logical since it was talk about history ;D

 

Though, if this is to tie in with the future Perrinland, I would say the repopulation would be somewhat to the west of the Caralain Grass, in the more forested area directly south of Saldeas southernmost point. If you take them to the plains that is more Caralain proper, they would be more connected to Andor.

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