The Book 8 blues...

[Aemon raHal]

*Rant and possible Spoiler warning*

 

 

So I'm on a re-read of the series.

 

All going well up until now. Flew through all the books - couldn't put them down.

 

But now I've reached PoD.

Six chapters - about 150 pages (excluding the prologue) - of nothing except the Seafolk, Kin and Bowl of Winds. Nothing there that couldn't have been done in 2 chapters (even the Moridin and Ghloam POV's).

 

But now I've reached Chapter 7. A Perrin chapter.

I know that this storyline goes on till KoD (FIVE BOOKS INCLUSIVE!!!) and its already driving me mad!!!!! Especially as its resolution on KoD is almost anticlimactic.

 

Has anybody else had this trouble on a re-read?? Knowing whats ahead doesn't help matters.

 

Any way to get through it - make it easier on myself??

Is it worth skipping the chapters I dont like and reading the chapter summaries on the website I don't remember right now?

[Zardi]

I completely agree with you about the Perrin and the Bowl of Winds storylines. They both lasted way too long and the resolutions didn't seem worth it. I expected something more between Perrin and Faile, and the BoW...it was used just like that, so quickly and without trouble, after it took them several books to find the thing.

 

Is it worth skipping the chapters I dont like and reading the chapter summaries on the website I don't remember right now?

I guess it depends why you're doing the reread. Are you looking for clues of what might happen in AMoL? Trying to pick up details you missed before? I'm doing a reread now of only my favorite points of view, but I'm doing it purely for enjoyment, not to pick up information. *shrug*

[Incubate]

now that you mention it, RJ did take a bit long to wrap that up but, i've also noticed that in the last few books, time has slowed, not literally but...

 

 

in the first couple of books almost a whole years(or more) would pass in a single book...

 

towards the later books, only a month or two will pass in an entire book, that's probably why it took so long for the whole Perrin/Faile and BoW thingymajiger

 

but to answer your original question, i think that if you're going to reread the series, you should read the ENTIRE thing and not skip around...

[Justin]

What a coincidence. I am also doing a re-read and just started PoD last night. I mostly skimmed through most of the chapters because, like you seemed to imply, it just drags on and just seems blah after 7 books. The Perrin plot is two books too long. I am honestly tempted to just read the summaries and skip it.

[Kadere]

I myself can't help but read every chapter of every book. I love this series, and those "slow books", I find to be full of intensity, and have a lot of cool smaller scenes. Plus the later books are much darker, and the characters aren't wide-eyed kids who've never seen a city before. I usually have to skim the first couple books to get to the later ones were the plot actually gets thick, and the characters are actually intregging.

 

But I'm probably the odd ball in this group, good for me. :D

[Zardi]

I do like the later books -- 9 is one of my favorites -- but it's just that Perrin's storyline bothers me. He gets so annoying :? My problem with the Bowl of Winds plotline is that the climax was disappointing, but at least amusing things happen in the mean time.

[Jonn]

My hypothesis is that RJ realized that Perrin was kind of becoming a more popular character after his heroics in the Two Rivers. he had cool powers, an axe, an aiel sidekick, and Loial. He had a moving chapter when he tries to be all hard about his family being dead, but he broke down. He raised the Red Eagle of Manetheren. By far one of the most entertaining arcs in the entire series.

I know he stole The Shadow Rising big time, and that was probably THE best book out of em all for me. I was looking forward to his chapters the whole time. So then he disappears, and all of a sudden he comes back all pouty and annoying with his annoying wife. Calculated from what I can tell. RJ knows Rand is about to take a turn for the worse and he doesn't want one of the other guys looking waay better than his principle hero. He really hasn't done any better with Rand since though. Mat is the opposite. He bothered me for the longest time up until the 5th book, and from then on he grew on me gradually, although all of that Tylin stuff in Altara was a bit much. The early stuff with Tuon bothered me, but it turned around completely in the last book. He went back to his element which is leading armies and being a bada$$. The fact that he wanted to win Tuon's hand for real was actually quite endearing.

 

It's a shame what he's done to Perrin, but I think he's going to restore him in a bit. The guy's taken enough punishment. Rand HAS to get the glorious ending. He is THE hero. Mat is alright the way he is, but he is going to blow the Horn. that's going to be pretty sweet.

 

What were we talking about? Oh yeah, book 8. There are some realy nice parts in there if you look for them. Try to get more intesne with the characters. Dealing with the Kin is kind of funny. The Seafolk are the ones that kill me to have to read. Every Moron Din Yellow Water Buginherbutt can just sail her #@% back to Wherever she came from for all I care. Again, balance. RJ showed us a really nice version of the Seafolk when Elayne was bonding with that windfinder on the way to Tanchico. Ever since then they have been all so very annoying. In KOD he showed us another side to them with their care for the Amayar. Still, he's going to have to do a lot better for me to really like another character from the Seafolk.

 

Pluses for me is the relationship between Elayne and Aviendha. Aviendha can really do no wrong in my eyes. She's just great. I just like the little dynamics between the two women knowing that they must share a man between them and another woman! Their friendship is very interesting. I've always thought so.

 

This book is the one with the unravelling of the waygate isn't it? I've always liked that part. Birgitte is cool to read about as well.

[MasterofBlades]

I've heard how lots of people hate Path of Daggers, and consider it the worst book in the series. Actually, I found book 8 a great deal less boring than Winter's Heart.

Book 8 actually has a bit of everything, in my opinion. Yeh, not as much lot developement as previous novels, but still had some good ones. One of the most important developements is Rand's Ashaman starting to become evil. We learn of Mazrim Taim's motives. Rand also makes a significant and unexpected decision at the end of the book, y taking off with Min.

The Seanchan battle scenes were also very good, and I noticed many readers like to complain this book had no action. But it had plenty of that too.

Honestly, I though Winter's Heart was very very boring, possibly the 2nd worst book behind Crossroads of Twilight...until the final chapter...which was VERY important. The final chapter, which ends with a battle with the Forsaken and the male half of the one power cleansed.

[Zardi]

See, I liked the entire Rand/Nynaeve plotline in Winter's Heart, but didn't care much for the battles with the Seanchan in PoD. Sure, it's lots of action, but...eh. *shrugs*

[Dionysus]

Ive never done a complete reread...

 

The first time I read the books, I skipped over a lot of the aes sedai/white tower stuff cause i wasnt interested...

 

Then I started reading theories and got interested in it and I reread all of the chapters dealing with it. The same with numerous other story lines. And not just the story lines, but RJ's Qotw, his blogs, everything dealing with the issue at hand.

 

A reread I dont think helps you as much as studying on a particular issue in the book, read the theories, gather up all the information on the web, and then read all the chapters dealing with that storyline. Its basically a reread but a lot more focused. It's just too hard taking everything in all at once, break it up, focus on one thing at a time, you will notice that they tie in to a couple of main story lines, and you get a more detailed understanding.

 

Although I agree with you, I find nothing interesting about the Perrin story lines post Two Rivers war... And I have never had to reread those chapters except to read about what Verin is up to, that stupid bitch, and still no clues... It better be good!

[Aemon raHal]

Is it worth skipping the chapters I dont like and reading the chapter summaries on the website I don't remember right now?

I guess it depends why you're doing the reread. Are you looking for clues of what might happen in AMoL? Trying to pick up details you missed before? I'm doing a reread now of only my favorite points of view, but I'm doing it purely for enjoyment, not to pick up information. *shrug*

 

Yeah, I'm reading just for enjoyment. Not for information really - thats just an added bonus.

 

 

When I read the series originally it wasn't that bad from book 8 onwards - the only one that drove me mad was book 10.

 

But now I know whats ahead of me, its all the more difficult.

 

Its the Perrin story - and I agree, he gets very annoying. I don't understand why it took so long to resolve this storyline. We don't even learn a huge amount from it all except that Perrin cares only for Faile (after 7 books of him giving out about people caring only for their own interests when TG was on its way).

 

Think I'll just have to skim some of those chapters.

[Red States Rule!]

Well I must say as to being boring... that's why I read the Asha'man and Al'Thor chapters.

[Aemon raHal]

Well I must say as to being boring... that's why I read the Asha'man and Al'Thor chapters.

 

I pretty much want to read it all... but I just can't get motivated to read book 8-10.

I know some pretty good things happen, but my god, some of it is just painful.

 

Such a dilemma.

[KellySedai]

I'm with Kadere. I have re-read the entire series 6 times now, and I will probably read it again and again. I read every line and that's mainly because the entire story with all its nuiances intrigues me to no end. Some of may be a bit drawn out, but all in all it makes the story complete. Perrin had me from day one, but I must say the best I've ever seen him is at Dumai's Wells. Perrin with an axe, Loial with an axe back to back killin sh*t... It don't get no better then that. :twisted:

[Inara]

i'm with kelly and i've read it all about the same number of times (except KOD- which i have read twice.

i read it all for the nuances. i love all those freudian things thaey say. its all about the characters for me...and i love it all.

[Incubate]

i've read the series several times and the only thing i find wrong with the later formentioned books is, I can't remember whether it's book 8 or 9 but one of them doesn't have MAT in IT AT ALL!!! :evil:

 

 

i hated that, but i can't remember which one it is, but i do remember that Mat is only MENTIONED in it ONCE!!!

 

 

INFURIATING!!! :x

[Kadere]

It's a Path of Daggers because Mat isn't doing anything at the time but recupporating in Ebou Dar.

[Incubate]

odd, i find that to be the most usefull book i own in the series...

[nighteyes]

I started a reread in April in the middle of may I was up to book 8 and I'm still about 100 pages from the end. The first time I read that book I kept hopping Peabrain would cut his own head off with his hated axe.

[Aemon raHal]

I started a reread in April in the middle of may I was up to book 8 and I'm still about 100 pages from the end. The first time I read that book I kept hopping Peabrain would cut his own head off with his hated axe.

 

Yeah, thats what I'm afraid of!

 

Don't like the Perrin storyline, and I hate the way the seafolk go on.

But I want to read all the books to pick up on things I missed 1st time 'round.

 

Just need to get motivated.

[nighteyes]

You could try telling yourself that Mats in the next book.

It didn't work for for me.

But it might for you.

[Aemon raHal]

You could try telling yourself that Mats in the next book.

It didn't work for for me.

But it might for you.

 

LOL, but if that worked, I'd be convinced that every Perrin chapter would be the one where he chops his own head off with his axe.

[mightisright]

Perrin's development into a real leader has been intriguing. He is the most sympathetic/caring leader in Randland. The problem is that that portion of his development has been regulated to the backburner during 8-11 because his agnst over Faile. Its in the margins when you read close and makes the chapters bearable and even at times exciting.

[Dashiva]

Personally i feel that if RJ took the time to write it I can take the time to read it. And every chapter is important to the whole series, slow or not. When books or character plots seem to slow down it adds to the realism of the series. Life isnt action and suspense all the time.

[Jonn]

Personally i feel that if RJ took the time to write it I can take the time to read it. And every chapter is important to the whole series, slow or not. When books or character plots seem to slow down it adds to the realism of the series. Life isnt action and suspense all the time.

 

Tolkien always lamented that he could not put his ENTIRE work into The Lord of the Rings. He wanted to put a lot more into the books than he did. Her had whole subplots and side theaters going on that we only get mention of in the appendices. Tolkien dearly wanted to present a more complete and detailed story, but what we did get from him was quite brilliant.

 

I think RJ is doing what Tolkien wished he could have done, but at the time it was ahead of its time to do. RJ is presenting a complete epic with full characters of complexity and doubts and all of the human frailty you can imagine. He's giving us a history that goes back thousands of years and a lineage to an almost too real world. We, I think, are rather spoiled when it is possible for us to complain that the author goes into too much detail in his work.

 

I think it's great that we know so many of these characters so well, that we could picture ourselves having a poker game with them and knowing all of their "tells".

 

I think RJ is fulfilling the promise of the fantasy genre that Tolkien always wanted to. It's an indepth, complex look into the hero cycle.