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I think mesaana is elza cause she had a great serpent ring on when she went to kill rand when rand was doing the cleansing. She also called the DO the Great Lord.


Elza Penfell: Green and Black Aes Sedai, part of the group who kidnapped Rand. She swears fealty to him after being declared da'tsang. Desperate to serve him. Killed Dashiva. From Andor.






Strengths and Talents

Relationships with other Characters

Misc. Information





General Information


Mesaana is one of the Forsaken, the thirteen most powerful Aes Sedai who joined the Shadow during the Age of Legends. (Reference: TEotW Glossary) During that Age she was known as Saine Tarasind, her job as a lecturer was not important enough for her to gain the third name. (Reference: BWB Chapter 6) When the Forsaken were all publicly known to have turned to the Shadow, the people gave them new names. (Reference: BWB Chapter 5) Saine became Mesaana, though we do not yet know what that means in the Old Tongue. However, we can assume that it relates to her character as others do. (References: TEotW Prologue)


During the Age of Legends, Mesaana was a lecturer to students at the Collam Daan. However, this was not what she wanted to be; she had wanted to be a researcher in the One Power since childhood. She worked hard to try to achieve her dream but the board at the Collam Daan did not think that she would be suitable. They gave her a job as a lecturer but Mesaana didn't like teaching the students about other people's research. (Reference: BWB Chapter 6)


Mesaana turned to the Shadow because she wanted revenge on the board at the Collam Daan for refusing her a research post. She was an average general but excelled at being a Governor. She had order in her regions, as much as there could be, and corrupted all children and teenagers in her territories. (Reference: BWB Chapter 6) Her schools taught the children the glories of the Dark One and those who didn't learn quickly were killed. (Reference: LoC Chapter 2) The children were encouraged to spy, lie and kill; mobs of children destroyed anything that reflected badly on the Dark one and killed people who opposed them. Courts were formed where all the members of the jury were children and they tried those who didn't support the Shadow. Those found guilty, as they all were, were executed by children. (Reference: BWB Chapter 6)


After Mesaana escaped from her prison, she established herself in the White Tower. (Reference: LoC Chapter 6) From here she uses the Black Ajah to help her create chaos. Most of all, she uses Aviarin, Keeper of the Chronicles to Elaida, to twist Elaida's orders to suit the Shadow's purpose. (Reference: ACoS Prologue) However, it is not sure who Mesaana is impersonating in the Tower, though several suggestions have been made. One of the most likely theories is that Mesaana is disguised as Danelle, Aes Sedai of the Brown Ajah. Her Ajah suits Mesaana as she was a lecturer and wanted to be a researcher; the fact that she has no friends would make it very easy for Mesaana to impersonate Danelle as there would be far less people to convince. (Reference: ACoS Prologue) Danelle is one of the sisters to overthrow Siuan, (Reference: TSR Chapter 47), yet she is ignored after this. Some sisters might object but Mesaana wouldn't be interested in the image of power that she might be given; her hold on Alviarin and Elaida gives her true power. However, this idea is only a theory, as are the suggestions that Mesaana is masquerading as Zaida din Parede Blackwing, Verin Mathwin, or Theodrin Dabei.


Mesaana is described as being of average height and appearance. (Reference: BWB Chapter 6) However, she only appears to Alviarin cloaked in darkness created by the One Power. She is tall and has a voice that sounds like crystal chimes yet that is all that Alviarin can tell. This is why Alviarin believes that she is in the Tower, either a servant or Aes Sedai. (Reference: ACoS Prologue) The illusion is broken when touched and Alviarin sees the hem of a bronze dress with black scrollwork. (Reference: TPoD Chapter 25) It has been argued that a sister would wear the colour of her Ajah; Danelle would therefore be wearing brown. However, when Shadar Haran visits Mesaana the weave of Illusion fails and Alviarin sees a woman with blue eyes who looks very familiar to her, though she doesn't have the ageless face of an Aes Sedai. (Reference: CoT Chapter 21) Some people have argued that this rules out Danelle but it should be remembered that Danelle has blue eyes and that Illusion works at it's best when the change is slight, thus Mesaana would look familiar but would not be recognised. (References: TSR Chapter 47 and LoC Chapter 52)




Condensed Timeline


Age of Legends: Mesaana was refused a job at the Collam Daan as a researcher; instead she was given the post of teacher. (Reference: BWB Chapter 6)


Age of Legends: Mesaana turns to the Shadow and sets up schools in her territories to teach children about the Dark One. (Reference: LoC Chapter 2)


Age of Legends: Mesaana is bound with the other Forsaken when Lews Therin and his companions seal the Bore. (Reference: TDR Chapter 36)


1000 NE: Mesaana receives a report from Alviarin on Elaida's plans and orders Alviarin to make as much chaos as she can within Elaida's orders. (Reference: ACoS Prologue)


1000NE: Mesaana doesn't go to Shadar Logoth even though she was told to stop Rand al'Thor and Nynaeve al'Meara from using the Choedan Kal. (Reference: CoT Chapter 21)


1000NE: Shadar Haran teaches Mesaana a lesson because she refused her summons for Shadar Logoth. (Reference: CoT Chapter 21)




Strengths and Talents


As one of the Forsaken, Mesaana has obviously great strength in the One power, (Reference: TEotW Glossary), though she is not the strongest of the female Forsaken, who is Lanfear. (Reference: BWB Chapter 6) However, when Alviarin sees her she cannot sense the ability to channel in Mesaana, nor can she see the weaves she has made. (Reference: ACoS Prologue) Mesaana is forbidden from touching the True Power since Moridin became Nae'blis. (Reference: WH Chapter 13)


Since Mesaana was alive in the Age of Legends and worked at the Collam Daan, she obviously has great knowledge in the One Power. (Reference: BWB Chapter 6) She is able to Travel, Mask the Glow and weave Illusion. (Reference: ACoS Prologue) If she is masquerading as an Aes Sedai, she knows how to partially Mask the Glow so that other channellers can sense that she can channel but do not know her real strength. Mesaana has found a ter'angreal somewhere and Alviarin uses it to summon Mesaana at great need. (Reference: CoT Chapter 21) Mesaana is similar in the One Power with Semirhage though she knows where she is stronger and weaker than the other woman. (Reference: LoC Prologue)




Relationships with other characters


None of the Forsaken are on particularly good terms with ach other and this is partially true for Mesaana. (Reference: TFoH Chapter 3) Mesaana is not comfortable with being around Semirhage and is not particularly fond of Graendal. (Reference: LoC Prologue) However, she, Demandred and Semirhage have worked together since the War of Power and have an agreement that they will not turn on each other until the other Forsaken have been killed off. (Reference: LoC Chapter 6 and WH Chapter 13)


Alviarin is Head of the Black Ajah in the White Tower and Mesaana uses her to spy on Elaida. (Reference: ACoS Prologue) However, she doesn't seem too worried when Alviarin is forced out of her position of Keeper and refuses to help her. She uses Alviarin for many of her errands even though there are other sisters that could help. (Reference: CoT Chapter 21)


Mesaana doesn't care who serves her in the Black Ajah as long as her demands are met. She does not even know the names of all of the Black sisters in the Tower and Salidar Aes Sedai. (Reference: CoT Chapter 21)




Miscellaneous Information


Mesaana was roughly three hundred years old when the Bore was sealed. (Reference: BWB Chapter 6)


Mesaana has never been interested in the appearance of power, she only wants true power. (Reference: BWB Chapter 6)


Bands of brigands during the Breaking were known as Mesaana's Children because they destroyed everything and anything in their path, like Mesaana had taught the children in her territories to do. (Reference: BWB Chapter 6)


Mesaana believes that using the One Power whilst doing things that only require concentration defeats the purpose. (Reference: LoC Prologue)


Relying on luck is not something that Mesaana likes; she doesn't like gambling everything to achieve something else. (Reference: LoC prologue)


Mesaana, in a fit of rage, lets slip to Graendal that she is in the White Tower. (Reference: LoC Chapter 6)


Mesaana claimed that she would have Rand under White Tower control, (Reference: LoC Prologue); however, her hopes rested on Galina and her fellow sisters who failed. (Reference: LoC Chapter 55)


Mesaana visits Shayol Ghul twice but she can't hear the Dark One and Shadar Haran is silent. (Reference: LoC Prologue)


Even Mesaana who learned a lot about the One Power while she worked at the Collam Daan doesn't understand vacuoles. (Reference: ACoS Chapter 25)


Mesaana teaches Alviarin some things to do with the One Power- for example Travelling, (Reference: ACoS Prologue) - but she also refuses to teach her more than is necessary. (Reference: CoT Chapter 21)






"I always thought you should be a teacher. Oh. I am sorry. I forgot"- Graendal to Mesaana. (Reference: LoC Prologue)


"Those three had worked together since before the War of Power. On the surface at least. She was sure they had plotted against one another as assiduously as any of the Chosen, but whether Mesaana undercut Semirhage or Semirhage Demandred, she had never found a crack between them into which a wedge could be driven"- Graendal about Mesaana, Semirhage and Demandred. (Reference: LoC Chapter 6)


"Mesaana hid herself because she might be recognised. She must reside in the Tower itself. On the face of it, that seemed impossible but nothing else fit"- Alviarin about Mesaana. (Reference: ACoS Prologue)


"Mesaana was the real source of her annoyance. The Chosen taught what she wished and nothing more, hinted at wonders and then withheld them. And Mesaana used her like an errand girl"- Alviarin about Mesaana. (Reference: CoT Chapter 21)

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Guest cwestervelt

Please read Winter's Heart. Or, if you have read it, please re-read it. Events there completely rule out any possibility of Elza Penfell being Mesaana or any other Foresaken.


Edit: I will quote the relevant Winter's Heart passage, since you have Crossroad's of Twilight included in your original post.


Walking slowly, studying the forested hills around them, Elza suddenly stopped as a flicker of movement caught the corner of her eye. She turned her head slowly, and not as far as the hill where she had seen that flash. The day had been very difficult for her. In her captivity amoung the Aiel tents at Cairhien it had come to her that it was paramount for the Dragon Reborn to reach the Last Battle. It had suddenly become so blindingly obvious that it astounded her she had not seen it before. Now it was clear to her, as clear as saidar made the face of the main trying to hide on that hill while peeking around a tree trunk. Today, she had been forced to fight the Chosen. Surely the Great Lord would understand if she had actually killed any of them, but Corlan Dashiva was only one of the Asha'man. Dashiva raised his hand toward the hill where she stood, and she drew as hard as she could on Callandor in Jahar's hands. Saidin seemed well suited to destruction, to her. A huge ball of coruscating fire surrounded the other hilltop, red and gold and blue. When it was gone, that other hill ended in a smooth surface fifty feet lower than the old crest.


1) She doesn't think the Dark One will get angry with her for killing any Chosen/Foresaken. That is a very unForsaken like attitude as scheming against eachother is second nature to them. They wouldn't have thought twice about it.


2) She only thinks Dashiva is an Asha'man. It isn't very likely that she wouldn't know who he was, or at least his importance/ranking. She has missed the last couple of Foresaken meetings, but Osan'gar and Aran'gar have been around for quite some time. The others all know who they are.

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Please read Winter's Heart. Or' date=' if you have read it, please re-read it. Events there completely rule out any possibility of Elza Penfell being Mesaana or any other Foresaken.[/quote']


lol, it would be funny if a chosen swore fealty to Rand, though.


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Asmodean sort of did, even though he was forced.


And yeah that thing from elzas pov. No forsaken have had a pov before we have known who they were, as that charcater. what i mean is, we saw rahvin as rahvin, not from gabreals sp? pov. hope that makes sense.

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Asmodean sort of did' date=' even though he was forced.


And yeah that thing from elzas pov. No forsaken have had a pov before we have known who they were, as that charcater. what i mean is, we saw rahvin as rahvin, not from gabreals sp? pov. hope that makes sense.[/quote']


you're right; forgot about that.


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