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What makes a wilder a wilder?

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RJ defines wilders as people who begin to channel without outside help. so by that definition sholdn't Moiraine be a wilder? Because she first started channeling in the sun palace before going the the Tower. On a simaliar note what about Liandrin? Who taught herself compusion also before going to the Tower. What are your thoughts?

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Guest Barmacral

I don't believe Moiraine was a wilder, as she was discovered very early on, and sent to the tower almost immediately. Also, I would imagine that Laman had an Aes Sedai advisor that would have helped teach Moiraine.

 

A wilder isn't someone who started to channel outside of the tower I don't think, so much as a person who channeled for an extended period of time without being taught by the tower.

 

It really depends on the views of the person in question though, for example, Elaida I believe did call Egwene a wilder at some point, and we know that Egwene did not start channelling until she was with Moiraine.

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I believe a wilder is a person who taught themselves to channel without aide of Aes Sedai. In other words, one who survives the transitional learning phase where there is danger of death.

 

 

EDIT: Wow, can't believe I wrote "teached". :|

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Hunter is correct. A wilder is any woman who learned to channel outside the Tower irrespective of wether they ended up in the Tower or not. Moiraine, and Suine incidently, are both wilders, as both had been channeling for some months before an Aes Sedai discovered it. As are Tarna, Searin and Liandrin (though she doesn't think of herself as such) that i can think of.

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I think Moraine is a wilder. And I don't think the term wilder can only be about channeling before reaching the Tower. I think it also has to do with the personality and attitude of the person concerned. Given attitude and personality, I would say Yes Moraine is a wilder. Plus she started teaching herself tricks before she went to the tower. And from one instance it sounded as if she figured out on her own how to channel by piecing together things she heard in stories of Aes Sedi.

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I don't think the AS have a real definition, but use the term when they want.

 

The term "wilder" is typically used as a perjorative, with the flimsiest excuse (not Tower trained, started channeling before coming to the Tower, has a mind of her own) to cast aspersions on a woman who can channel by an AS who is having difficulty manipulating said channeler (or has other reasons to besmirch said channeler). True, an AS who knows that a woman had come to the Tower as a novice with only the spark should not be able to call the woman a wilder, but absent such knowledge (e.g., in KoD, the prisoner who claimed to be Leane) can be so ridiculed.

 

AS have a real problem with the Wise Ones, who have a very extensive training program, and with the Windfinders (evidence of rigorous training also), but who are not Tower trained. As Wise Ones and Windfinders do not defer to the AS, obviously they are wilders. It's the myopic, snobbish "if you didn't go to my school, you cannot possibly add or read" attitude that the AS (most of them, anyway) have.

 

So, a wilder is a woman who might have channeled before taking Tower training, or who is not known to be Tower trained, or (if really reaching for an excuse) might have learned some channeling technique outside of a Novice classroom) that an AS wants to put down.

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Moiraine wouldn't be considered a wilder, I think a wilder is someone who went through most of their training or growth in the power outside of the tower.

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No, she is. When Verin explains what a wilder is to Nynaeve, she states Moiraine as an example.

 

I have a real problem with the dissmissal of the Wise Ones as wilders. Their organisation, as an organisation that locates and trains girls who can channel predates the tower, is much more successful, and who hold a much greater position of power and respect in their society without binding themselves.

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I think it's kind of the whole idea of wilders, the Aes Sedai being so prejudiced about channelling. Anyone who isn't virtually 100% tower trained is not one of them. It's a weakness of theirs that they're so exclusionary. As a group they're no better than Whitecloaks in some ways.

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As she learnt before any aies sedi found her (New Spring talks about her tricks etc) i think she could be considered a wilder but as she was obviously found out very soon afterwards i think that stopped her from being put in the true wilder basket..

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Wilder. n. Any woman who teaches herself to channel without or before joining the White Tower, or is taught to channel by someone who is not Aes Sedai(again without or before joining the White Tower).

 

Does that definition work for everyone?

 

Note that this makes Moiraine a wilder, and makes runaway Novices and Accepted trained or organized by the Kin not wilders.

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