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Niniel

[Game thread]: WoT Kids Mafia

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ATM I think a lot of posts up to this point could be either town or scum trying to under/over play their responses to the situation. DJ's response to Nyn's random vote on her being overly critical, or over- analyzing as DJ puts it, and then her later responses to questioning could be town/scum.

 

SK going after Ben pretty hard for what he called a joke vote seems scummy to me. You called out one player when another had done something quite similar.

 


So Ben.... lets get serious here... it can't be all just fun and games....
 
You scum broseph? Cause you ain't fooling me again :P

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I know you said it was a hunch, which is anything anyone has to go on D1, but was there anything else that made you feel that way? Or are you trying to get discussion going?

 

I have to agree with RandA about your claim LZM. I don't see what you'd gain from claiming as town but if you're scum, trying to get some town leans for "that's not something scum would do" would be beneficial. 

 

As I'm curious as to your thoughts [v]Vote SK[/v]

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Sounds forced in what way? Or are you saying Ben wasn't trying to change the subject? Talk to me dood.

I don't think he was trying to change the subject, I responded directly to him and asked him a question, and he answered it.

 

 

No, I just got into it with Darthe in my second game and then said some things to him in a PM that I shouldn't have, and so since then, I have tried to be careful not to get into a back and forth, and Niniel had even warned us all in the rules that she would have a low tolerance for it, so I'm trying to just respond to his points and not his lol #hashtags. I feel like I have answered everything for him, and his vote seems to be entirely about a lol comment to DJ, so I'm moving forward.

 

I feel exactly the same about the Broncos. Those are good observations! I thought they should have taken a lineman, either a DEcto replace Malik or an O lineman to replace anyone, but they traded up for Lynch, and so far, I don't see much future for him.

 

 

You gotta work on your quote game man hahaha :P

 

And ok that's fair, makes sense for now.

 

And thanks!! Yup, I agree there, I think that they got back on the right route this year by drafting Garrett Bolles.  And agreed, they need to shore up their interior, because only player I like there right now is Derek Wolfe.  Even their new NT, Domata Peko I don't feel too good about, so I wouldn't be surprised if their run defense woes continue onto this season.

 

 

I am here. For now.

 

Nothing I have read gives me an indication one way or another on anyone. So, that being said, I am Sammael.

 

Discuss

 

 

I hate WIFOM so much, so I'm going to mostly ignore this.  Niniel obviously said that there would be bad characters mixed into the good guys, and vice versa, or something along those lines, which essentially makes character reveals useless.  However, if I did have to analyze this, I don't see what you'd get to gain as town by randomly outing yourself as Sammael, whereas if you were mafia, you could definitely play the card (or hope people play it for you) that mafia would never do anything so scummy or to draw attention to them, and get some easy town leans in the beginning.  Based on that, I have a slight scum read on you, which is compounded on by the more important statement you put in here that nothing here gives you any indication one way or another on anyone.  I agree there are no major clues, but we've already had one clash between Ben and SK, one smaller more lighthearted clash between Ben and DJ, as well my FoS on SK and a light one on DJ.  That's plenty compared to what's usually present in the first 10 pages of a game, yet I don't recall you making this kind of comment in the last game we were in, which although it started quick as well, didn't have more content at this point than we do in this game, and you were town in that game.  Those two things combined, I have you as a definite scum read.

 

So so far, I guess I'm going scum reads over town reads this game, but I got LZM and SK as my two strongest scum reads (which isn't really saying much atm), followed by a weak read on Ben, and not much on anyone else, maybe a slight town read on DJ.

 

Hahaha It's so hard to do this on my phone! I don't trim well even on a PC, but doing quotes on the phone really challenges me. 

 

You seem to know the Broncos quite well. I think that if Peko doesn't wear out, he will be fine. So far, he looks good. If we can get 20 snaps a game out of him, I think Kerr can handle the rest. He seems big enough to spell Peko inside. 

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I dont have much experience with SK or most of the players really. Last game as scum he was very measured in his posts and overall neuteral in tone. He posted in small bursts and it was usually pretty logical overall. He was going with middle of the road approach and it worked for him.

 

This game he seems less concerned with how he comes across so far and there's a bit of sas to his tone. I feel like he's more engaged and he's in plain sight. So he's either very capable and switching things up to avoid meta detection... or he could just be town this game.

 

I'm not familiar enough to determine much atp but he does seem like a capable player. Reminds me a little bit of clov. And as such i rather observe him for a while and take my time. But right now he's not on the table for me.

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Has everyone checked in now?

 

Good to see everyone. I'm going to read overvpoats in the morning and try to determine my initial thoughts on everyone.

I think so

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Okay, Niniel said at the beginning that the characters and the flavor really have nothing to do with the game, that any character could be town or scum, so I don't see the point in claiming, and I really don't see the point in counter-claiming, but I'm interested in seeing which one is lying over nothing. Unless neither one is Sammael. :unsure:

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I counter claim sammael.

 

@Randal i did not see any question I was to focused on ben.

 

@Lessa let me get on my laptop and answer you.

 

[v] unvote [/v]

[v] LZM [/v]

 

I'll post my reads on the other people so far.

 

Then that's something you need to work on SK, especially if you're going to tunnel on ben that hard, at least take the time to read the posts he quotes (because he quoted me asking a question to him).

 

That being said, I had both of you as scum reads, but I'll believe the guy who CCs because that'd be a very weird move for scum to do.  So [v]LZM[/v]

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No, I just got into it with Darthe in my second game and then said some things to him in a PM that I shouldn't have, and so since then, I have tried to be careful not to get into a back and forth, and Niniel had even warned us all in the rules that she would have a low tolerance for it, so I'm trying to just respond to his points and not his lol #hashtags. I feel like I have answered everything for him, and his vote seems to be entirely about a lol comment to DJ, so I'm moving forward.

 

I feel exactly the same about the Broncos. Those are good observations! I thought they should have taken a lineman, either a DEcto replace Malik or an O lineman to replace anyone, but they traded up for Lynch, and so far, I don't see much future for him.

 

 

You gotta work on your quote game man hahaha :P

 

And ok that's fair, makes sense for now.

 

And thanks!! Yup, I agree there, I think that they got back on the right route this year by drafting Garrett Bolles.  And agreed, they need to shore up their interior, because only player I like there right now is Derek Wolfe.  Even their new NT, Domata Peko I don't feel too good about, so I wouldn't be surprised if their run defense woes continue onto this season.

 

Hahaha It's so hard to do this on my phone! I don't trim well even on a PC, but doing quotes on the phone really challenges me. 

 

You seem to know the Broncos quite well. I think that if Peko doesn't wear out, he will be fine. So far, he looks good. If we can get 20 snaps a game out of him, I think Kerr can handle the rest. He seems big enough to spell Peko inside. 

 

Ahh gotcha, yeah mobile trimming is definitely a little bit of a challenge, always takes me some time to make sure I got the right opening and closing tags matched up.

 

And RIP haha, I spend way too much time looking at NFL stuff in general, thanks though, I know about Peko specifically because I was analyzing the contracts that he and Sly Williams got and thought that they weren't worth it for the level of play they had in 2016, as both had down years relative to their normal play.  The thing about Peko to me is that although he's had a little bit of name recognition, he's never really been that good for the past several years.  I use BR's scouting projects and PFF's grades from the past two years to get an idea of how a player's been in the past, and Peko's graded out poorly in the last two years via PFF, and BR's scouting projects haven't even had them in their top ~50 defensive tackles since 2013, where he still wasn't top 50, he was just placed 59th.  However, that being said, he was a NT before, but in a 4-3 scheme, so idk if switching to 3-4 will be the scheme change he needs, or the environment change.  He had good teammates in Dunlap and Atkins, but you simply can't match the kind of support on the line/edge you get when you have Von Miller/Derek Wolfe/Shane Ray/Shaq Barrett/DeMarcus Lawrence all around you.  How has he looked this preseason? I haven't been able to really follow the Broncos this preseason, other than to hear whats happening with the QB battle.

 

I dont have much experience with SK or most of the players really. Last game as scum he was very measured in his posts and overall neuteral in tone. He posted in small bursts and it was usually pretty logical overall. He was going with middle of the road approach and it worked for him.

 

This game he seems less concerned with how he comes across so far and there's a bit of sas to his tone. I feel like he's more engaged and he's in plain sight. So he's either very capable and switching things up to avoid meta detection... or he could just be town this game.

 

I'm not familiar enough to determine much atp but he does seem like a capable player. Reminds me a little bit of clov. And as such i rather observe him for a while and take my time. But right now he's not on the table for me.

This is a good point about SK, he's definitely off his meta from last game as mafia.  How much experience does SK have again?  I'm curious if he's experienced enough to change up his meta like that.

 

Okay, Niniel said at the beginning that the characters and the flavor really have nothing to do with the game, that any character could be town or scum, so I don't see the point in claiming, and I really don't see the point in counter-claiming, but I'm interested in seeing which one is lying over nothing. Unless neither one is Sammael. :unsure:

I thought about the neither one is Sammael possibility, but it seems very unlikely.  And you don't see the point in counter claiming? You catch someone in a lie, given that you're telling the truth obviously.

 

I'm very interested in how we have a direct cc, but we don't have any votes from you or Nyn after the reveal.  I would mention DJ too, but she obviously hadn't read anything and was going to reread (unless that's just what she wanted us to think)

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Why would scum claim flavor that isn't theirs when flavor makes no difference?

 

I agree, maybe it was a shot in the dark to a role he didn't think would exist?  But yeah that's definitely weird.  The other question is if LZM's telling the truth, why would mafia randomly cc?

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Hey guys, I'm here I guess? I'm currently in an emotionally broken state (perhaps, as I always have...), so if I sometimes dissapear for a few hours I'm...yeah, but here are my thoughts on the stuff so far:

 

Dar'Jen--have you been in a game with random votes before? Just curious due to the way you reacted to the vote.

 

-snip-

Just trying to find out if action, wording, phrasing had given clues or something.

-snap-

A bit squinty at the "given clues" because might be implying that you're actually scum, but might just be wording?

 

Ben's reaction/line of thought is a bit eeeh??? to me--I'll try to do something similar to an iso here (is there a function that allows me to do so here?) to get a better idea of my read on Ben.

 

 

I am here. For now.

 

Nothing I have read gives me an indication one way or another on anyone. So, that being said, I am Sammael.

 

Discuss

A bit squinty on this because it seems to me like an attempt to pretend to be participating in the discussion while not actually contributing, which allows them to fly under the radar?

 

Thank you for the "Happy Birthday"s, btw~

 

I'll hopefully be posting my thoughts on Ben as well as whatever seems to cross my mind later in a bit~

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Dunno I'm more interested in the actual claim. If LZM claims a random character he can hit a character of a townie or scum. So the the cc is null. Town would cc and a smart scum would too. Ie... i dont think the cc is a lie. Just that the root of it is... why would lzm claim a character that isn't his?

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Ahh gotcha, yeah mobile trimming is definitely a little bit of a challenge, always takes me some time to make sure I got the right opening and closing tags matched up.

 

And RIP haha, I spend way too much time looking at NFL stuff in general, thanks though, I know about Peko specifically because I was analyzing the contracts that he and Sly Williams got and thought that they weren't worth it for the level of play they had in 2016, as both had down years relative to their normal play.  The thing about Peko to me is that although he's had a little bit of name recognition, he's never really been that good for the past several years.  I use BR's scouting projects and PFF's grades from the past two years to get an idea of how a player's been in the past, and Peko's graded out poorly in the last two years via PFF, and BR's scouting projects haven't even had them in their top ~50 defensive tackles since 2013, where he still wasn't top 50, he was just placed 59th.  However, that being said, he was a NT before, but in a 4-3 scheme, so idk if switching to 3-4 will be the scheme change he needs, or the environment change.  He had good teammates in Dunlap and Atkins, but you simply can't match the kind of support on the line/edge you get when you have Von Miller/Derek Wolfe/Shane Ray/Shaq Barrett/DeMarcus Lawrence all around you.  How has he looked this preseason? I haven't been able to really follow the Broncos this preseason, other than to hear whats happening with the QB battle.

 

I dont have much experience with SK or most of the players really. Last game as scum he was very measured in his posts and overall neuteral in tone. He posted in small bursts and it was usually pretty logical overall. He was going with middle of the road approach and it worked for him.

 

This game he seems less concerned with how he comes across so far and there's a bit of sas to his tone. I feel like he's more engaged and he's in plain sight. So he's either very capable and switching things up to avoid meta detection... or he could just be town this game.

 

I'm not familiar enough to determine much atp but he does seem like a capable player. Reminds me a little bit of clov. And as such i rather observe him for a while and take my time. But right now he's not on the table for me.

This is a good point about SK, he's definitely off his meta from last game as mafia.  How much experience does SK have again?  I'm curious if he's experienced enough to change up his meta like that.

 

Okay, Niniel said at the beginning that the characters and the flavor really have nothing to do with the game, that any character could be town or scum, so I don't see the point in claiming, and I really don't see the point in counter-claiming, but I'm interested in seeing which one is lying over nothing. Unless neither one is Sammael. :unsure:

I thought about the neither one is Sammael possibility, but it seems very unlikely.  And you don't see the point in counter claiming? You catch someone in a lie, given that you're telling the truth obviously.

 

I'm very interested in how we have a direct cc, but we don't have any votes from you or Nyn after the reveal.  I would mention DJ too, but she obviously hadn't read anything and was going to reread (unless that's just what she wanted us to think)

 

I think we got Peko for less than we would have had to pay Sly if we had picked up his 5th year option, and Peko, in his day, was better than Sly is now, and Peko's little cousin is on our team and shows promise (kid unfortunately got injured in OTA's, but I think he should be back soon), and so we (the fans on MHR, the SB Nation Bronco blog) mostly felt like if we can get one decent year out of Peko (and we imagine him seeing fewer snaps than he saw in Cincinnati, I mean, he was getting like 35 snaps a game with them at his age), then he's a stopgap who can hopefully help elevate his cousin. Also, we expect to get a serviceable fat guy at cut down time from one of the other teams with better DL depth to help with the rotation. 

 

I don't know how much experience SK has, but he seems to have a solid grasp of the game and carried us early on when Clovdyx got busy and started to disappear, and then when I got home from vacation and started posting a lot more, he coached me up a lot with some good advice, so I would assume that he's a good player. I guess I also assume that he's a he, but it actually says "not telling." :unsure: I guess that means I get to decide, and I have decided that he's a dude. :smile:

 

Well, I guess I just don't understand all of the implications of claiming and counterclaiming. My experiences with it are as follows: In my second game, I was leading a train on Darthe, who suddenly claimed to be Harry Potter (it was a Potter-flavored game), but since the mod had said at the start that mafia had safe claims, I figured "So what?" The other players were split between, "Oh wow, he's Harry Potter; don't lynch him," and "So what?" It turns out that he was Harry Potter, and he was town, and it was a big "So what," because he could just as easily have been mafia, per the mod in the dead thread. 

 

In my last game, DPR claimed vig, then scum killed him, and he flipped as vanilla town, and I did not see the point in it, except that you said that he did it because he was reading scum to so many people that he knew he was a distraction, so he got scum to NK him, essentially taking one for the town team, even though he reduced their numbers by one. Nynaeve went into this further with me in a Facebook chat we had the other day, where she explained that it is important to spot roles as well as town and scum, because if I am a vanilla townie, I might want to claim a PR for the similar reason as DPR, namely that it's better for me to die as a VT than to lose a PR, and I think I understand that, BUT...

 

...there are no power roles in this game (unless we upset the mod, which means those roles would probably suck anyway), and the characters are all random (meaning Perrin could be scum and Alviarin could be town), so wt actual f with this claim and counterclaim? :unsure:

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Hey guys, I'm here I guess? I'm currently in an emotionally broken state (perhaps, as I always have...), so if I sometimes dissapear for a few hours I'm...yeah, but here are my thoughts on the stuff so far:

 

Dar'Jen--have you been in a game with random votes before? Just curious due to the way you reacted to the vote.

 

-snip-

Just trying to find out if action, wording, phrasing had given clues or something.

-snap-

A bit squinty at the "given clues" because might be implying that you're actually scum, but might just be wording?

 

Ben's reaction/line of thought is a bit eeeh??? to me--I'll try to do something similar to an iso here (is there a function that allows me to do so here?) to get a better idea of my read on Ben.

 

 

I am here. For now.

 

Nothing I have read gives me an indication one way or another on anyone. So, that being said, I am Sammael.

 

Discuss

A bit squinty on this because it seems to me like an attempt to pretend to be participating in the discussion while not actually contributing, which allows them to fly under the radar?

 

Thank you for the "Happy Birthday"s, btw~

 

I'll hopefully be posting my thoughts on Ben as well as whatever seems to cross my mind later in a bit~

 

I spent my 40th birthday in tears. They can be hard. Tomorrow's a new day. :smile:

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The PR nini mentioned means something else. PR is both role or a punishment. Depends on the context it is said.

 

Basically what she means is she'd give the person some form of in game punishment... like having to rhyme every time you post :-p

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The gist of what we talked about is that a VT will want to draw the nk to give prs another day. But you're right that this is not pertinent to this setup.

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Hey guys, I'm here I guess? I'm currently in an emotionally broken state (perhaps, as I always have...), so if I sometimes dissapear for a few hours I'm...yeah, but here are my thoughts on the stuff so far:

 

Dar'Jen--have you been in a game with random votes before? Just curious due to the way you reacted to the vote.

 

-snip-

Just trying to find out if action, wording, phrasing had given clues or something.

-snap-

A bit squinty at the "given clues" because might be implying that you're actually scum, but might just be wording?

 

Ben's reaction/line of thought is a bit eeeh??? to me--I'll try to do something similar to an iso here (is there a function that allows me to do so here?) to get a better idea of my read on Ben.

 

 

I am here. For now.

 

Nothing I have read gives me an indication one way or another on anyone. So, that being said, I am Sammael.

 

Discuss

A bit squinty on this because it seems to me like an attempt to pretend to be participating in the discussion while not actually contributing, which allows them to fly under the radar?

 

Thank you for the "Happy Birthday"s, btw~

 

I'll hopefully be posting my thoughts on Ben as well as whatever seems to cross my mind later in a bit~

 

 

Aw man infiniti, I've been there, hope you feel better!

 

Also I'm guessing squinty means you feel weird about something?

 

Also isoing is a little hard on here, my personal way of doing it is using the multiquote option and going through each page with a ctrl+f ready with their username and just going down the results.

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The PR nini mentioned means something else. PR is both role or a punishment. Depends on the context it is said.

 

Basically what she means is she'd give the person some form of in game punishment... like having to rhyme every time you post :-p

 

Oh, okay. I thought it was punishment VIA a Pr, like Village Idiot or one of the other bad roles I read about on wikipedia yesterday before we really got rolling. They had something where you can't vote, and one where you have to be silent for an entire day, and all kinds of weird roles. 

The gist of what we talked about is that a VT will want to draw the nk to give prs another day. But you're right that this is not pertinent to this setup.

Yeah, I understood the gist, I guess I just couldn't express it. I'm sleepy. 

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Hey guys, I'm here I guess? I'm currently in an emotionally broken state (perhaps, as I always have...), so if I sometimes dissapear for a few hours I'm...yeah, but here are my thoughts on the stuff so far:

 

Dar'Jen--have you been in a game with random votes before? Just curious due to the way you reacted to the vote.

 

-snip-

Just trying to find out if action, wording, phrasing had given clues or something.

-snap-

A bit squinty at the "given clues" because might be implying that you're actually scum, but might just be wording?

 

Ben's reaction/line of thought is a bit eeeh??? to me--I'll try to do something similar to an iso here (is there a function that allows me to do so here?) to get a better idea of my read on Ben.

 

 

I am here. For now.

 

Nothing I have read gives me an indication one way or another on anyone. So, that being said, I am Sammael.

 

Discuss

A bit squinty on this because it seems to me like an attempt to pretend to be participating in the discussion while not actually contributing, which allows them to fly under the radar?

 

Thank you for the "Happy Birthday"s, btw~

 

I'll hopefully be posting my thoughts on Ben as well as whatever seems to cross my mind later in a bit~

 

 

Aw man infiniti, I've been there, hope you feel better!

 

Also I'm guessing squinty means you feel weird about something?

 

Also isoing is a little hard on here, my personal way of doing it is using the multiquote option and going through each page with a ctrl+f ready with their username and just going down the results.

 

Or you can click on their profile and then click on posts. I think there's a limit to how far back it goes, but it should be a start.

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